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Rally Wednesday calls for officer accountability

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by KGW.com Staff

Posted on November 24, 2009 at 10:00 AM

Updated Wednesday, Nov 25 at 1:09 PM

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PORTLAND, Ore. -- A group critcal of an officer put on leave for a beanbag gun incident involving a 12-year-old girl rallied in downtown Portland Wednesday.

The Albina Ministerial Alliance said the rally at the Justice Center aimed to hold Officer Christopher Humphreys accountable, after a police rally Tuesday in support of the officer on leave.

Humphreys was placed on paid leave by Chief Rosie Sizer and Commissioner Dan Saltzman last week after firing a beanbag shotgun round at close range into a 12-year-old girl's thigh. Previously, Humphreys had been investigated, along with other officers, for excessive use of force in the 2006 death of James Chasse.

Sgt. Scott Westerman, the president and spokesperson for the police bureau union, said he expected a few hundred cops and their family members from across metro Portland to rally in support of Humphreys.

"This affects all law enforcement. This affects public safety across the region. When a commissioner makes a political decision and disciplines an officer or suspends and officer for following his training -- this has a widespread affect," Westerman said.

"Let him come out here and let his daughter or son be Portland police officer,"Cathy McCarthy, the mother of one officer said. "I do find it hard whenever everybody acts like these folks are the enemy."

Police officers will also have the opportunity this week to cast a symbolic vote of no confidence in police leadership.

Officers will receive ballots in the mail asking whether to issue a statement of no confidence in Chief Rosie Sizer and Commissioner Dan Saltzman.

Saltzman recommended that Humphreys face a two-week suspension for his role in the death of Chasse, a 42-year-old schizophrenic who died in police custody three years ago.

On Tuesday, Saltzman released a statement of support for police and Chief Sizer.

"It's a tough time for him and for anybody that goes through that so we're showing our support for Chris," said Det. Todd Teat.

A rally and a no-confidence vote against a Chief and Commissioner haven't happened since 1981.
Officers rallied then after two of their own were fired for dumping dead rodents in front of a black-owned business.

As was the case then, officers today are saying politics is driving decision-making, not fairness.
Critics in the crowd disagreed.

"There should be some disciplinary action," said Jessica Bannister. "I feel that that they need to police themselves and they need to respect the higher authority."

"I support the police," said citizen John McGuiness. However, "there's a limit, you know, at 12-years-old," he added, referring to the girl subdued at the MAX stop.

Mayor Sam Adams' spokesman says the Mayor backs Saltzman's decisions on all these issues.
Results of the union's symbolic no-confidence vote. will go public by the the end of the month. In 1981, officers voted no-confidence overwhelmingly against then-Commissioner Charles Jordan and then-Chief Bruce Baker.Commissioner Saltzman was tapped to lead the police force last year by then mayor-elect Sam Adams. Traditionally, the mayor of Portland also has overseen the police bureau.

Humphreys, already on paid administrative leave, was reportedly unavailable to comment on the shooting or face discipline because of disabling stress, the Oregonian reported last week. 

Westerman dismissed the newspaper report as biased and noted the city could discipline an officer on disability if it chose.

"The issue of going off to act as if this was a way of avoiding discipline is absolutely not true," Sgt. Westerman said. "Humphreys has indicated to me ... he will make arrangements to be interviewed because he wants to clear his name because he's done nothing wrong."

Humphreys shot the girl Nov. 7 at the NE 162nd Ave. MAX platform in Gresham. He and other officers were responding to reports of a large party that included "suspected gang members," according to a prepared statement from Chief Sizer at a Nov. 19 press conference.

A responding officer recognized the girl and believed she had been expelled from TriMet ridership, according to Sizer's statement. She resisted arrest and was subdued by a group of officers. During the altercation Humphreys shot her. The entire incident was caught on TriMet surveillance video.
Watch the raw, unedited surveillance video clips:
Clip 1 | Clip 2

Less than three months before the beanbag shooting an internal police bureau investigation cleared Humphreys of wrongdoing in Chasse's death. Internal Affairs was also to investigate the beanbag shooting incident, according to Sizer.

(KGW Reporter Randy Neves contributed to this report)

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veganpeace said on November 23, 2009 at 7:03 PM

This planned act of disobedience and offensive behavior must be immediately prohibited by Executive Orders issued by Co-Presidents Shelly and Barack Hanford Obama. The idea that "Peace Officers" think they have the collective right to protest, especially in this case where an innocent child was stone-heartedly assaulted by Bush/Cheney/Reagan trained thugs, is beyond comprehension. Moreover, this cruel incident only confirms the belief of all of us in the Prog/Green/Red/Statist/Vegan community that all weapons, lethal or not, should be seized from all law enforcement. Had these uniformed Jackboots been given sensitivity and diversity training as practiced by Sean Penn and Hugo Chavez,, they would have been able to resolve any issues with the 12-year-old victim of Bush social policies, without resorting to violence.

shalelemanjelus said on November 23, 2009 at 8:18 PM

Its just rediculous that three, fully trained law enforcement officials cannot seem to take a 12 year old adolescent down without resorting to violence. this just shows how poorly they are trained, not only that but it also gives basis to the old fact that MOST hate law enforcement. if the swine law of this city resulted in actually learning how to NOT take a life, but protect it as what they claim they are doing then MOST would basically trust them, but we see all the time the cops beating mentally handicapped persons, killing innocent bystanders and covering it up afterwards. I think we need to make a change, get someone in office that will pass a law thats states if a cop even does stuff like this he faces jail time himself, passes the judge and jury and goes straight into lock up. maybe that will open their eyes and give them a new sence of life on the outside, coz they harrass us, lock us up for no reason. so take their freedoms and they will see how it feels...

ceedub said on November 23, 2009 at 8:20 PM

Innocent child???.......whatever.

shalelemanjelus said on November 23, 2009 at 8:30 PM

Just watched the vid. and that was totally NOT by the books.. The three need to seriously get themselves checked for ability to be on the job, that video (#2) shows nobody else on that platform, but then they haul HER off the train, assault her and they just are allowed to walk free? just because they have a badge does NOT give them a liscence to kill, and injure people, this just reinstates what many have known about them, they do not protect coz if they did, this stuff would not happen. the law like the senate is sooo badly corrupted that america has fallen to the dogs, sorry to say, but if I was present those three would be in a coma right now... I fully support chief sizemore, she did the right thing, the fools that support this swine is actually who needs to be replaced, and never be allowed to work as a cop in this counntry ever again. she was tackled and shot by a cop with a bean bag because why? she was excluded, wow what a basis for such intolerance by our swine.

hero8 said on November 23, 2009 at 8:58 PM

Shalelemanjelus and Veganpeace you are morons. You have no idea what you are talking about. Obviously, neither one of you are educated or no anything about laws. Someone might take you a little more seriously if you could spell or string together a decent sentence. I have just a few words for you - Go back to school and get your diploma!

hero8 said on November 23, 2009 at 9:05 PM

Officer H. is an upstanding officer following protocol. You want to fight a fight, take it up with the Chief who designed the policies he practiced. You really want to make a difference meet up with the parents of the 12 year old who is out at 11 p.m. on a school night, at a party with suspected gang members and guns, who has been arrested previously, and who feels it is okay to hit another human in the face - police officer or not. Disgusting behavior. Work on respecting the human race.

tigerkc67 said on November 23, 2009 at 9:59 PM

She deserved it. The officer did nothing wrong in my opinion. Kids these days get away with way too much because we let them. 12yrs old, 17yrs old or 22 yrs old they can carry and need to learn to respect. If he had shot any other part of the body or if she was cooperating then yes, but she was fighting them and she needed to be controlled for her safty as well as the officers.

suprmaum said on November 23, 2009 at 10:03 PM

The comments being made about this incident are EXACTLY the reason comments from the general public should not be allowed!

volvolover said on November 23, 2009 at 10:56 PM

Maybe the City of Portland should set up a vote by the people who live there....I would be willing to say that the PPD would get a big vote of no confidence for their attitude

patmcg said on November 23, 2009 at 11:16 PM

Way to go KGW. Make the news instead of reporting it unbiasedly, then incite your brain dead, tree hugging whimps to post nonsense, like volvolover, and shalelemanjelus. Then censor most of the posts that actually make sense..You guys are as bad as these lowlife punks that take over MAX at night.

patmcg said on November 23, 2009 at 11:16 PM

Way to go KGW. Make the news instead of reporting it unbiasedly, then incite your brain dead, tree hugging whimps to post nonsense, like volvolover, and shalelemanjelus. Then censor most of the posts that actually make sense..You guys are as bad as these lowlife punks that take over MAX at night.

patmcg said on November 23, 2009 at 11:17 PM

Way to go KGW. Make the news instead of reporting it unbiasedly, then incite your brain dead, tree hugging whimps to post nonsense, like volvolover, and shalelemanjelus. Then censor most of the posts that actually make sense..You guys are as bad as these lowlife punks that take over MAX at night.

patmcg said on November 23, 2009 at 11:18 PM

Way to go KGW. Make the news instead of reporting it unbiasedly, then incite your brain dead, tree hugging whimps to post nonsense, like volvolover, and shalelemanjelus. Then censor most of the posts that actually make sense..You guys are as bad as these lowlife punks that take over MAX at night.

patmcg said on November 23, 2009 at 11:20 PM

Way to go KGW. Make the news instead of reporting it unbiasedly, then incite your brain dead, tree hugging whimps to post nonsense, like volvolover, and shalelemanjelus. Then censor most of the posts that actually make sense..You guys are as bad as these lowlife punks that take over MAX at night.

ptcvolunteer said on November 24, 2009 at 8:16 AM

The most prosperous and respected nation in the world is about to be annihilated by an oncoming train because we have been deafened over the past 40 years by the incessant WHINING of LIBERAL VICTIMS. The morals and values that I was raised with emphasised REPECT for law enforcement and the thought of striking a police officer was, well, unthinkable. Now we rise to the defense of a CRIMINAL rather than support the folks (imperfect as they may be) who put their lives on the line to protect us. So sad...

beaglebuggy said on November 24, 2009 at 8:45 AM

Officer Humphreys' needs to sue the portland police buereu for stress from doing his job right. The 12 yr. old brat needs to be sued for assault on a police officer. The 12 yr old brats parents should be sued for allowing their minor child to assult the police. Then they should be publically caned with rosie sizer and dan saltsman for making this a political circus. When will the police hire attys and start to collect money from the perps and government that should be supporting them. It is NOT the police that write the laws and rules they must follow. And the chasey incident has NOTHING to do with this! They are totally seperate and the office was cleared let it go! Keep up the good work PPD we the uncriminal citizens that support you!

sallee said on November 24, 2009 at 9:12 AM

Right on Hero8! I also support the officers. Kids do what they want anymore and sometimes it really isn't the parents fault.

gunmay said on November 24, 2009 at 10:14 AM

Well put BeagleBuggy! I would expect nothing else if it were my own child, but wait my children at that age would still be under my supervision... and I would assume full responsinility for their actions as a responible PARENT!!!!!!

gunmay said on November 24, 2009 at 10:15 AM

PTCvolunteer !! also well put:)

ceb969 said on November 24, 2009 at 10:36 AM

So we let her get away with this! What will it be the next time the cops run in to her, will she have a gun or a knife? How many times will a cop let this slide before he or she gets killed? To the bleeding hearts out there in my younger day you hit a cop you were in jail and wishing you had not touch the cop (billy sticks hurt)!! Sorry to see the Max Train get so bad, I think it is safer to ride a New York subway than it is to ride Max at night.

notsocasual said on November 24, 2009 at 11:44 AM

I think I have figured out the perfect solution to this problem. Now all we need is Vince McMann to sign off. Let's schedule a cage match the next time WWE is in town. We can pit our own Dan "Lion Tamer" Saltzman against all 153(ish) pounds of "Innocent Angel" and see who comes out on top. After all, a grown man should be able to subdue a "frail little girl" without resorting to a bean bag gun. What do you say Dan, are you up for it? Or would you rather just "arm chair quarterback" like you do right now.

takingcrazypills said on November 24, 2009 at 11:44 AM

Sallee go on believing your BS and don't take responsibility for your breeds actions.

kpportlandnormal said on November 24, 2009 at 12:11 PM

I'm tired of all these wimps in Portland! The girl disobeyed the orders of a police officer as well as assaulted them. She got what she deserved in the end. Enough said!

blazerfan said on November 24, 2009 at 12:26 PM

I support the PPD! That "little girl" was clearly out of control and had no respect for the officer. The officers follow a strict code of conduct. The actions taken were justified.

catlover09 said on November 24, 2009 at 12:29 PM

My dad had a saying when we were growing up - Do the crime, do the time. What was a 12 year old doing out at that time of night? And why is it not surprising that her irresponsible parents are hiring a lawyer? My guess is that the reason this "child" has the attitude that she has is that she has never had to take responsibility for her actions. PERIOD! "I don't care that my kid hit that other kid - that other kid probably made her mad. No she shouldn't be expelled." "What do you mean my kid was caught with a weapon, drugs, driving drunk, beating down a classmate....? - you name it... - my kid is not taking that punishment. Who do you think you are?" Kids like this, have parents like this. It once took 2 cops and 4 personell at a mental health treatment facility to get my 9 year old step-daughter under control before she hurt herself or someone else. Yes, this girl should do the time for assaulting a police officer. PERIOD!

donttasemebro said on November 24, 2009 at 12:37 PM

Christ some of you people have no idea what you're talking about. Gee let's see, there is a girl who is assaulting Officers, what the heck do you expect, a baton? Brute physical force? a 50,000 volt Taser? or a f-ing beanbag that'll leave a simple bruise. Believe me, she was better off with the beanbag. Quit being such a criminal lover and deal with it. If you resist arrest and assault Officers, you WILL have force used against you, period. Don't be a criminal and you won't have to worry about it.

sallee said on November 24, 2009 at 12:50 PM

Maybe 'takingcrazypills' out to stop taking them.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 12:50 PM

What none of the people posting here seems to understand is that it the issue is not if the police should have questioned and detained her for being excluded and being out after curfew, they should have. The question is not whether she should have complied with police and should face the consequences for her actions, she should be. The question is was this truly excessive and brutal force used by the police on a 12 year old. 3 adults vs 1 child, and don't fool yourselves she is a child, past wrongs or not. She was shot at close range with a bean bag round, which can still kill, while being restrained by two other grown individuals. If a single officer can't restrain a pre-teen girl they have no business being on the force. There was not danger from this girl, they simply decided to make their job easier by using greater violence. Both parties have their faults, however the fact remains she is a child acting out, they are adults who should know how to stop her with less violent means.

cry4u said on November 24, 2009 at 12:52 PM

So you think you can do better well please do so. So many are quick to judge but no one is ever willing to step up and say that what she did was wrong and if she would have done that to someone other then a police office then it would be said were are the police to stop this from happing. it is dame if they do or dame if they don't so get over yourself. it is time to stop the maddness and let the kids and the out of controll bad people know we are not going to put up with this any more. and we need to start by making all parents responseable for the kids and adult for their own actions. as for the officer not being trained properly i would love to see you go throw what they have gone through to become an office of the law. i am a parent of a porland police office and am very proud to say so. if that was my child that acted in the manner for with that 12 year old did i would not have a problem putting her on t.v and making her say she is very sorry for being so disrespecful.

cry4u said on November 24, 2009 at 1:03 PM

Shalelemajelus this is for you and the stupid words you said. People always are quite to call a police officer a killer well more people have been saved by police officer then have been killed. you never hear anyone saying good job or thanks for saving the persons life. my daughter help save a ladys life when her own husband tried to kill her. murder /suicide. so if this child as we all call her can party until all hours of the night then she can pay for her own actions. stop saying that the police are wrong here for the are right..........

tedterry42 said on November 24, 2009 at 1:08 PM

I am a retired Philadelphia police officer and don't get me wrong she did do wrong but it dosn't give the officer the right to shoot her point blank range. If I did that in Philadelphia I would have been fired. We were taught NOT to shoot that close to a subject. He had enough police on sceane to subdue her.

notsocasual said on November 24, 2009 at 1:14 PM

pacificviking, are you willing to take the place of Dan "Arm Chair Quarterback" Saltzman in my cage match to see if you and you alone can subdue "Innocent Angel"? Do you have any idea of the kind of pain a PO'd 12YO 153lb (ish) adolescent can inflict on you. I don't care what gender the perp is all it takes is the right appendage in the right spot and it just won't matter how big the cop is. And what if "innocent angel" had a knife on her somewhere and managed to stab our, in your polly-anna world, disarmed police officer. Would you personally face their family to tell them their loved one died because YOU were AFRAID the police might ACCIDENTALLY use excessive force? I didn't think so.

veganpeace said on November 24, 2009 at 1:19 PM

Far too many posters are still missing the primary issue. All law enforcement must be immediately disarmed and stripped of any type of S.S. endorsed non-lethal force. In fact, our Post Bush society does not need any police- private citizen patrols schooled and highly trained in non-violent verbal communication will eliminate crime at its RethugliKKKan caused core. As for this illegal march, all participants should be arrested for sedition and sexism since Chief( an offensive title) Sizer is a female and therefore this entire disgrace on our community makes this action a hate crime.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 1:45 PM

NotsoCasual and cry4u, Both of you need to grow a brain, and learn some critical reading & thinking skills (this goes to veganpeace as well but for other reason.). I never called her an angel, point of fact I agree that up until the bean bag shot was fired the police did nothing wrong. I have a great deal of respect for police officers, in fact I have two friends in the PPD , because of the dangers of their job. However the line drawn for my continuing respect of the individual officer stops when they choose to abuse their power, use excessive force, or protect those who do. The facts are these A 12 year old, out of control youth involved in an altercation with 3 fully trained and qualified police officers, 2 of which already physically restraining her on the ground. The third officer can be seen in the video circling around, waiting for his chance to fire upon an underage suspect, as she was at the time, when there was clearly no need. This is excessive, and you seem to be blind.

graham said on November 24, 2009 at 1:52 PM

Sure a cop is going to support anyother cop, it's call the good old boy system. If a cop can't deal with a 12yr old with out haveing to shoot them, then he's not much of a cop. The trouble with some cops is they are looking for someone to shoot.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 1:53 PM

To people like Notsocasual, Veganpeace, and Cry4U, all fit nicely into the same category, the world is black and white, right and wrong, based on snap judgments and their thoughts are based solely on their own Pre-existing condition of self imposed ignorance. To them any who disagree with their view of the order of the world are immediately labeled naive, lumped together with anyone else who does not agree with them. Both are extremists with little sense of the reality that this is a dirty world, and in many situations both sides have fault. Police should not be dis-armed, but they also should exercise restraint in the use of that force. Police should not be flippantly reprimanded, especially for political reasons, but they should also not be allowed to hide behind their badge when guilty of wrong doing themselves. Taking arguments to the extremes resolves nothing, improves nothing, and causes all rational discussion to come screeching to a halt. They have nothing of value to offer.

rebel1 said on November 24, 2009 at 2:45 PM

I have 14 years of LE experience and have gone hands-on with a number of violent unarmed 'tweens without the luxury of adequate cover (assistance from other officers.) That said, I was shocked to see less lethal impact munitions being deployed at such a close range. There are a variety of munitions with rated distances, none of which (in my experience) are recommended to be used closer than 3 yards (9-10 ft) due to the risk of penetration. Man up and take your lumps on this one buddy. Good luck with that creative writing assignment known as a Use of Force Report. I'm sure you will have more than enough help and time to write it.

copsppb said on November 24, 2009 at 4:19 PM

ok for all of you cop haters out there, this weekend go stand on the max platforms at night unarmed. and then come back and comment on wether you felt safe. Don't just stand there for a little while stand there for 10 hrs, like a cop would and report back to all of us reading these posts. Tell us how many assaults, drug deals and thefts you wittness. I can only imagine the biggest complainers are the ones that stay clear of that area because it is not safe. Who will you call when you are being assualted or robbed? If you hate the cops so much will you turn them away when you are in a situation where they are needed? Are you that tough? Or is it your words that make you tough because you can sit in front of your computer in safety and write down your vial thoughts.... you are cowards. I pray that you are never in a situation where my loved one is called to a situation where he will be defending you, and he pays the ultimate sacrifice for your selfish being.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 4:37 PM

Copsppb, It is one thing, & a wrong one, to hate the police. Quite another to turn a blind eye to the mistakes and short-comings that they, being human beings, are sure to make at some point, which is just as wrong. Police officers are due our respect, support & compliance in 98% of circumstances, however when they are the perpetrators of injustice, when the trust the public has placed in them is abused they must be held to account. In fact a higher degree of accountability must be met by the police as they are charged with upholding the law. A group of civilians engaged in a similar situation, lets say in defense of a defenseless party, taking similar action, had they by some chance had immediate access to a shotgun with bean-bag rounds, would have been charged with at the very least assault with a deadly weapon. Those who hate he police are wrong, however as citizens it is out duty to hold them accountable when they violate the trust and sanctity of their position.

howard_b said on November 24, 2009 at 4:59 PM

Two-week suspension???? This pig should be hanged!

orfreak1 said on November 24, 2009 at 5:07 PM

This only confims that the COPS ARE CORUPT! These police officers need to serve and protect not destroy and arrest and sneek around like jerks. The officer should not only be suspend he should be fired. I was trained in the military in security and these cops are terribly trained and should not be caring guns. They act like mocho jerks and then expect people to hear there cause when one of there own gets disaplined. You know what FIRE ALL OF THEM! Rehire only the one that really deffend the people and not try to TAKE CARE OF BUSSINESS!. COPS SUCK!

notsocasual said on November 24, 2009 at 5:55 PM

Now, if he was so thuggish and so trigger happy, why didn't he simply pop the first perp with a bean bag? Why not just pop "innocent angel" instead of trying to manhandle her? Am I the only one who sees that they at least try before using NON-LETHAL force on this perp? As to your comments about how I view the world: I don't see it as black and white, I see it as brown. Brown as in poop. What I see is a whole bunch of people who don't give a rats droppings about anybody but their self and to HE__ with anybody who says different. These people seem bent on pooping in the very pool from which the drink (figuratively of course). I see well meaning lib-tards try to say "society has failed these people" and I agree. "We" have given them too much and expected too little and they have lived down to "our" expectations. When the mother was too busy to speak to the news but was rather on her way to see a laawyer

copsppb said on November 24, 2009 at 6:00 PM

to pacific viking. you are right police officers should be held accountable for their actions and be held to a higher standing.Please remember you are only getting a portion of the facts when you listen to the media. only so much information can be released. we have to remember there was much more going on in the surrounding areas that was not caught on tape. like the initial 911 calls that led those officers to that platform. when an officer responds to a potentially dangerous call with known gang members.( lot's of them) what should the officer bring? I just get so frustrated at all the finger pointers. My husband risks his life everyday to keep the people of portland safe. let's not forget them. before we judge let's hear all of the facts first. and howard-b you are sick.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 7:14 PM

Copsppb Firstly let me express my thanks and respect for your husbands service to our city. I do understand that I have not heard the 911 calls, and was not on the scene. However after watching both surveillance videos posted here, the lack of any group near the police aside from those bystanders watching events unfold, it seems clear that this is one of those incidents of true use of abusive force. At the time the less lethal force force was used she was on the ground being subdued by two other police officers. I have a hard time accepting that any firearm should have been used in this situation on almost any suspect. Had she posed an imminent threat of death or severe injury to the officers involved, bystanders, or herself the situation would be entirely different. In honesty this situation seems, in my opinion, to be a single officer deciding to teach an out of control youth a lesson. The police are not employed to dole out punishment, but to prevent and investigate crimes.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 7:23 PM

Notsocasual You seem to have a hard time understanding facts, bean bag rounds are not "non-lethal" they are less lethal, meaning that they still can, and do kill people, especially when fired from too close a range. You also seem to be operating under the assumption that I am arguing for her innocents, certainly not, she deserved to be place under arrest and face the consequences of her actions. You applaud the police for teaching her a lesson, serving her with their own brand of justice. That is NOT in the purview of their job, and it certainly isn't justice. Unfortunately now instead of this girl facing the true consequences of her transgression, an over zealous police officer has likely given her and the family that produced and failed to control her a payday at tax-payers expense. Also way to miss the point, at issue is not the girls guilt, but the force that was necessary vs the force used to subdue her, they are not related, and to attempt to link them is absurd, and no the issue

doh_dad said on November 24, 2009 at 7:50 PM

I understand the controversy over a 12 yr old girl being involved in this altercation. But...had it been a 30 yr old man with the same physical dimensions...would this be an issue? I don't think I would want to trade places with any of those officers.

blondbomber said on November 24, 2009 at 8:22 PM

Some of you need to rewatch the video clip. There were only TWO count them TWO officers until after the beanbag round was SKIPPED of the "Little Angel" thigh. A big fat meaty thigh of a rather large combative, out of control 12 year old. Watch the video again you morons. and as far as the "cops" who say they are cops.........................really wow go back to your security jobs and shut your mouths you are clueless.

unsung_one said on November 24, 2009 at 8:48 PM

I have watched footage of this incident a number of times now and still feel that Officer Humphrey and his partner acted appropriately given the situation they faced. There was an out-of-control thugette fighting with police officers ON THE PLATFORM with 55 ton trains arriving and departing on either side. What if the brat in question knocked one of the officers onto the tracks as a MAX train was pulling in? Or what if she ended up on the tracks herself? We just had someone die recently after being hit by a train pulling into a station in Gresham. I dont see the bean bag round as a way to "teach a lesson" about not fighting with police, but rather bringing a combative person under control in a dangerous situation. Its as simple as that.

pacificviking said on November 24, 2009 at 11:28 PM

also bean bag rounds don't skip, like a 6 year old at recess, they impact, causing internal injury, and rebound off the target that is what they are designed to do.

topazgirl said on November 24, 2009 at 11:56 PM

I was raised to respect Police Officers, and I appreciate the difficulty (and danger) of their job! Most of them are hard working, caring and professional, and risk their lives for us everyday...but I am not so naive as to not spot a bad one when I see one!! Humphreys is an embarrassment, and should be terminated! No one is questioning the fact that this youth needed to be arrested...she was obviously out of control! (Although, I'm still confused as to what it was she did!...) But if 3...count them!...THREE police officers can't subdue and cuff one unarmed girl without the use of weapons, then their training is sorely lacking! I've seen many officers restrain agressive adult men, much larger than HER, without beanbag guns, so I know it can be done! Your blind acceptance of any and ALL police behavior is INSULTING to the GOOD cops that don't resort to these tactics! I have some understanding of the "Blue Line", but I wish a few of the GOOD officers could speak up without retaliation!

gmoney said on November 25, 2009 at 1:56 AM

For those of use who feel the officer was justified for his actions consider this. The issue is not the 12 year old girl, who she is, why she was there, or her actions. The issue is the use of a shot gun at close range. The police chief is correct to be very concert with the officer’s action. The officer’s action is the issue. Those weapons can be lethal, the officer is lucky he did not kill the girl. The designed use of a bean bag shot gun is approximately twenty feet away. Police officers in Oregon are trained to know that when there fire their weapons it is with the intention to kill the suspect. There we other options available to the three police offers present. Would all of you have the same comments if this 12 year old girl had been killed? That’s what the police chef is concerned about, and she is right to be concerned.

starstruck said on November 25, 2009 at 7:13 AM

gmoney, I don't think that the PPD are trained that when they fire their bean bag gun that it needs to be with intention to kill. I would hope PPD would give them a little bit more powerful weapon to fire if they intend to kill. This would be a different story if he would have shot the unruley child in the face, but I think that her thigh can handle a bean bag. He did what he felt needed to be done, which is his job and which is why he was hired to protect the city. Maybe the people that are wasting time and money on this whole ordeal should spend it on the family, get that girl some help to straighten up her life while she is still young. She obviously is out of control, and she is not even a teenager yet....

shallowend said on November 25, 2009 at 9:17 AM

It gets down to this: Was firing at a thigh at close range the way they were trained or not? Sizer and Saltzman are disturbed and feeling "not what we expect of PPD", but neither one will address what the training in this situation is. If Humphreys violated policy, discipline him. If not, admit it, put him back on his job and change the policy (if it needs to be changed). As to whether 2 or three officers "could have" subdued the girl: IRRELEVANT! What is the policy? What is the training?

shallowend said on November 25, 2009 at 9:19 AM

And if three officers had wrestled the girl to the ground and handcuffed her in a struggle, the same posters would be bemoaning the excessive force used ("three men on one little girl"). According to your logic: if a suspect resists, just let them go!

corporatemom said on November 25, 2009 at 11:14 AM

Thanks for removing my comment KGW. I guess if people were accountable for their actions you would have nothing to report. Bottom line - let's hold those accountable that should be held accountable - the 12 yr old girl and her parents. Why was her rear end out at 11 pm???? So far, by age 12 she stays out late, hangs with gangs, disrespects police, resists arrests, gets kicked off mac, beats on police officers...have I left anything out??? And to Albina ministries - why don't you hold education series that teaches how to properly raise children and how to respect those in authority. Be part of the solution - not the problem.

katuismobetta said on November 25, 2009 at 11:14 AM

Should have just shot the stupid little tramp with a real shotgun and been done with it. We will all be supporting her and her six kids in the near future.

topazgirl said on November 25, 2009 at 12:15 PM

'Mom: ...Good point about The Albina Ministerial Alliance! People need to accept responsibility in raising their children! If the family needs support in this, the Church should step up to help! Hold a rally about THAT!! I agree with Bill Cosby when he advocates for engaged and attentive parenting...it's a National Shame that many parents are AWOL when it comes to this...And that goes for white families as well as black and Latino!! There are plenty of White kids 'thrown away' to the streets of Portland, as well!. Right on, 'Mom!! ..... Shallowend:....I still hold firm to my belief that this situation was handled POORLY!! I saw the video...she was a wild cat! But if these officers had left the shotgun out of the equation, this would NOT have been an issue, and there would be public support for how this went down!! The gun was used for "convenience", NOT necessity!! It's this same cop, over and over again...I think he has run out of "coincidences"! His actions are an "ongoing lawsuit"!

topazgirl said on November 25, 2009 at 12:29 PM

Shallowend:...My "logic" no more says "just let them go!" than YOURS says "shoot to kill!"...There is a happy medium somewhere in between, here! The Police are trained to know what "reasonable force" is!...I think they GROSSLY missed the mark! Yes, I too would be curious to know what the policy is here!...But I agree with Gmoney! I have heard this beanbag shotgun is meant to be used at a range of approximately 20ft...anything closer could be life endangering.....

archangels said on November 25, 2009 at 1:10 PM

This is a problem with our city when many turn a blind eye when police officers are allowed to use deadly force when deadly force is unnecessary – in Chasse’s situation and in Fouad Kaady. In Sept 2005 Fouad Kaady was shot to death by Oregon police officers – he was naked and in shock, burned over most of his body from an auto accident. Instead of calling for an ambulance – police officers were not able to control him because he was in shock - he was critically injured. Two officers decided to use deadly force shot him to death. http://www.videosift.com/video/Cops-shoot-burnt-injured-man-who-crawled-from-burning-wreck This police behavior is not OK. Watch the video.

archangels said on November 25, 2009 at 1:35 PM

The Killing of Fouad Kaady - Oregon Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8WijDe5BhQ&feature=related Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVS-Fba0ExU Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-JPZOI8hbc Part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0zb02wORc Part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJNNG4o0d1A

thalvers7174 said on November 25, 2009 at 1:40 PM

So an officer can use a beanbag gun to subdue a twelve-year-old. Then why can't a parent do the same? This bothers me because if a parent were to use this kind of tatic they would be charged with abuse and get their child taken away.. And I am sure that if the CHILD in this situation was so out of control to the police, she is 10x worse at home. And the schools.. These are the people who deal with kids like this on a daily basis. But somehow manage to not use such force. Children with behavioral issues are difficult to deal with. They have episodes on a daily basis and often more than once a day. Destructing the house, hurting sibilings and parents. At school they disrupt students and teachers constantly. Even with many tools in place, they still act up. But no one grabs a beanbag gun to handle the situation.. Who is smarter the Adult or the Child?

notsocasual said on November 25, 2009 at 1:44 PM

Ok, POSVIKING. So I don't fully type out every little detail on this new interface KGW has saddled us with. 1000 characters is a little too little sometimes and I don't include the minute with my post. Bean bag rounds are considered less than lethal munitions but yes, less than lethal munitions can and do cause deaths when they are misused, as one of the posts on this thread pointed out. That is why, when <20 feet a torso shot is not allowed. But within 20 feet any extremity is fair game. NOW, I DO UNDERSTAND that even blunt force trauma to an extremity can cause damage (it's all about the hydraulics of the blood) to your internal organs, but that has to be weighed in the full context of this event. 1) Officer Humphries, who many describe as a trigger happy thug, was shown in the video A) arresting some other perp all the while having his shotgun slung over his shoulder. B) During the take down of innocent angel he STARTED with the shotgun slung and TRIED to use physical force

notsocasual said on November 25, 2009 at 2:20 PM

dumb character limit; tried to used physical force before resorting to his Less Lethal alternative. And of his alternatives, Taser and pepper spray get everybody so they can't be used at such close range. That leaves either a night stick or a bean bag round. Which do you choose? topazgirl: Grown men are limited in what they can do to physically wrestle a female to the ground as opposed to wrestle a male to the ground. This is because all "innocent angel" has to do is scream "sexual assault" and their lives are over, even worse than they are now. Viking: the ONLY reason this family now has the million dollar lottery ticket is because the people of the county don't demand accountability from our leaders who would rather settle a lawsuit than deal with the litigation costs. When you start doing that you start inviting anybody to sue you whenever their feelings get hurt. Yes, I realize this is more than feelings so don't get your panties in a wad

nvwine55 said on November 25, 2009 at 2:56 PM

She is a criminal waiting to happen - she was asking for it and got it. A life lesson for this girl.

gunmay said on November 25, 2009 at 3:10 PM

corporatemom! well put again:)

bsassy said on November 25, 2009 at 8:27 PM

shalelemanjelus- you obviously didn't see clip #1, and if you did, I think you're as sick as that girl. The female clearly took a swing at the police officer. AFTER the ASSAULT on the police officer...an officer appeared to take aim...indicating to me, he was very much in control. I don't care how old that girl is, she's out of control. I personally think the faster the officers subdue somebody, the better (especially in such an unsafe area). graham- this isn't about the good ole boy system. This isn't just police officers defending each other. It is citizens defending police officers!

pacificviking said on November 25, 2009 at 9:36 PM

Okay one more time for notsocasual, they are not "Less-than-lethal" they are LESS LETHAL meaning even when used according to prescribed use can and do cause death in some cases. Take another look at video clip #2 the officer involved reaches for his gun before the physical altercation begins, then replaces it on his shoulder, attempts for less then four seconds to assist in restraint in that time throwing at least two knees into her mid section, then stops assisting officer #2, removes his gun to fire the shot. There were three officers in very close proximity to the altercation the third shows up in the videos view less than 1 second after the bean bag is fired. Let us not forget that this is one of the same officers who severely beat a mentally ill man, and refused him medical treatment when requested, resulting in that mans death. This officer was not interested in restraining the girl, as much as demonstrating his power. This in no way diminishes the girls fault in the matter.

pacificviking said on November 25, 2009 at 9:46 PM

She should be held accountable for her actions. However she did not get "what she deserved" as the more blood thirsty in this conversation would try to claim. What she deserved was justice, that being apprehension, detention, the filing of charges and a guilty verdict of assault of an officer. The over use of force can not, and should not be a means of justice. Street justice is not what this country is about. There are grown men who acting in the same manner towards police who have received more restrained treatment. There was no need for the force applied. The issue is not the whether or not the girl deserved to be subdued and arrested, she did the issue is the amount of force needed to achieve the justified result. The issue is that this is an officer who has, at least twice, shown that he has little to no respect for his position, or the people he is supposed to protect. The application of REASONABLE force when needed is the difference between legitimate policing, and a gestapo.

corporatemom said on November 26, 2009 at 8:14 AM

pacificviking - this time it was only a bean bag. Next time it could very well be a real bullet from some gang members gun. This kid is on a fast path of destruction - hold her & her parents accountable.

skier1 said on November 26, 2009 at 9:37 AM

Why was a 12 year old girl allowed to be out at 11pm without adult supervision? Where were her parents? Her parents/guardian needs to be put in jail and charged with child neglect. The girl needs to be placed in foster care and closely monitored as well as counseling to correct her behavior. She was trespassed from the MAX for other issues and knew she was not supposed to be riding the train then when confronted by officers she assaulted them. She was caught and she knew it but there was no reason for her to fight the police. When you fight the police bad things can happen so the best thing to do is not to fight the police.